Tree Leaf

Member for
9 years · 6 months · 20 days
Find a Grave ID
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A census is not a birth or death record; it is not considered solid proof for such data. It is also unreliable for names: spelling, order, etc. There is no way to verify who gave the information, and censuses often do not even match each other. The enumerator sometimes made mistakes. etc. Please have stronger proof than census for top of page data. It can be a starting point or a puzzle piece but is not conclusive, in itself, for the basics.

Please, never presume who is related to whom, or how. In fact I *am* related to most pages I manage, either by blood or by marriage. But that's not the site mission and never has been. Find A Grave is an index of final dispositions; everyone is welcome to add valid, verified pages to its index. I added cemetery lists to this site to help fulfill its aim to index every burial. (Also because it hadn't yet been done, and people deserve to find their loved ones.)

In so doing, I discovered just how deep and far a given family's roots run. I've tried my best to share *everything I find* including with pages I do not manage. I cite sources and type entire obits as I send things. This is to help others as well as to save the other page manager the time. Others have my family in their management, too; like everyone else here. Just know if you 'yell at' someone they could be YOUR cousin too.

(Why not consider thanking members here, instead, for helping to find your loved one's resting place??) Many of us also update with genealogical information and links; but again it's not the site's mission or primary purpose. All info added should be cited and verified, as in proper genealogy. Ask a lineage society if "I said so" is a citation. Please be patient and understanding. We are all volunteers, here. We have outside lives, no matter how paltry (some might see fit to tell us) that is.

How much, and what, I add relies mostly upon what I am able to find to verify it. The worst thing I could do would be to misidentify anyone, or wrongly link anyone, by approving incorrect or unproven suggestions. There's nothing wrong with taking the time to prove it out. In fact, it is encouraged that we do so.

These memorials are virtual gravesites, per the stated site mission. (They are not scrapbooks. They are not bulletin boards.) Please, only photos of the resting place and photos of the decedent during life, should go in the Photos.

One might see a marker, or a photo or engraving of the deceased at a gravesite. One hopefully would never run into a flurry of Xeroxes. Please respect the memorials as the virtual gravesites that they are. This too is respecting the decedent.

The first stated mission of this site is to register accurate final dispositions. That means verified grave locations, whether that mean cemetery, at sea, etc. The second is as a virtual grave visitation.

FIND A Grave is not a genealogy site. Please do not tack things onto memorials which do not really go there. The biography section is where biographical data should go -- not in Photos, their captions, or flowers.

Only messages of repose should go in the flowers.

I'm a very active member. Please do not go around or over me by skipping the edit process. I am here to work with. Please, use the edit system as intended. Please send a link to proof, via "suggest other" (in edit tab), rather than tack information into flowers, or screen grabs in the photo sections. Abusing the photo and/or flower area is contrary to site protocol. Please, per protocol, send edits via menu and proofs via the SAC, whether typed, pasted, or linked to. This takes 2 minutes, tops.

"Suggest other" is found in "edit" tab. The "Help/FAQ" section says the "suggest other" (SAC) is how to send documentation. If it's a clipping, drop a link. If it's data, copy and paste, *with* book or collection title, please.

I've typed obits and other information into tens of thousands of biography sections. That is where it should go. Please, work *with* me. I constantly add to biographies, make links, update tops of page. I simply wish to be a good steward and manage responsibly by verifying it first. I simply wish to follow site protocol, which works well, when followed. There is nothing wrong in that.

I habitually research and add to pages on my own 'steam,' possibly more often, even, than edits prompt it. It simply is untrue that I "refuse to add anything." That type of rhetoric is psychological pressure: not helpful collaboration, not proof for suggested changes.

If it's within copyright years it will be paraphrased. If it's been found on a popular genie site others will find it there. Please put xeroxes and screenshots onto public trees or blogs. Please do not give me a hard or even abusive time if I have requested proof or declined for lack of conclusive proof; Ancestry which owns Find A Grave has said many times "Genealogy without proof is a myth." At least contact me civilly and let's work together. Above all please do not misuse flowers and photos, out of respect for the decedent, if not even for this site or other members of it.


*Please do not send merges that are not the same person* or that are valid pages. Unless two or more pages are one person and are in one cemetery, it is not a duplicate. There can be a marker in more than one cemetery, or a burial and a cenotaph, etc. Please read biographies carefully as those will often make obvious it's (for instance) one adult and one child. Or an unmarried person vs. a wife.

Also check plot locations. If the plot locations differ -- it's not the same person. But some cemeteries don't use plot locations, or people are in the same lot, with the same names and even years. Sometimes people have the same first/last names AND years but are not the same people. Sometimes all the record has is a surname, maybe a first initial and either a year or no dates. Still doesn't mean it's the same as another.

Please research first, to make sure it really is the same person in the same cemetery. Please don't just send pages that look similar, because it is OFTEN the case those are DIFFERENT people. Such as a father and a son?! Sometimes records do not have dates and more than one person has the same name. Please do not erase valid memorials this way. It does not hurt me -- it hurts the decedents.

After years of managing and researching and sending and receiving edits, here are a few thoughts.

If I ask for documentation it is not meant as an insult to your capabilities. It means I did not find any myself, and am trying to verify information.

If none is received, or found, then per admin a manager is within their rights to decline.

If documentation is sent it should be sent via "suggest other" in the edit field of a memorial. This is in the FAQ we are all supposed to have read. Asking for citations to be sent this way, is not someone being difficult but, per FAQ, is the appropriate procedure.

Proof is not defined per se. The volunteers here mostly are not professional genealogists. No one is familiar with every source or collection out there. Please be patient and explain if there are any questions. Refusing to communicate because the message board is off shuts the door in the manager's face for no legitimate reason.

People turn off message boards because people misuse them to send edits or citations or to send verbal abuse, none of which are its purpose.

We are not obligated to share an email or to communicate outside of this website's jurisdiction. All "suggest other" go directly to email anyway.

The site is an index of final dispositions. Grave locations and final dispositions should be verified. Please do not make burial unknowns, plops (guesses) or other invalid pages. The second purpose stated by this site is to allow a virtual grave visitation. Both are invalidated if the disposition is guessed or not given at all. There are memorial sites and genealogy sites. This website resource is a burial or final disposition index, and virtual grave visitation. (Its two stated purposes.) *Please do not ask me to link to burial unknown* pages.

Please do not take the family research, provided to help others with their tree, to make a plop (guessed location), then link or ask me to link to it. Usually the plop is wherever another family member was previously verified. I could've just made a fraudulent burial memorial, at the time I included family info, rather than spend inordinate amounts of time in some cases, trying to find the 'missing' grave, only to not make the memorial because there was no proof of burial. Some I try so hard to verify and find. But if disposition was not verified, their page should not be made just to fill in the blank.

To the second stated site purpose. Virtual visitation. I don't remember the last time I saw papers on a grave. Please do not put scans, documents, clippings, etc., in the photo section. The photo section should be for a photo taken during decedent's lifetime, and/or a photo of their final resting place. The image guideline is no text and no borders; scans, clippings, certs., have both. It also detracts, in my opinion, from the 'virtual visitation' aspect, visually. If one person found it on a genie site someone else will, too; please respect the memorial as a virtual grave.

Instead please use "suggest other" or "SAC" to paste a link, if the material is meant as a citation. If it is not online it can be posted on a public tree, or photo sharing site, then, that link sent via SAC. We are to comply with copyright law; that too is in the FAQ. Some images are in copyright via the newspaper or website even if the written material no longer is. So things should be transcribed or rewritten into the bio, which is where biographical material should go.

Please do not abuse the inscription or flower fields.

Please do not send repeated messages saying the same things, or the same edits more than once via the edit fields. Those are both contrary to site policy, per admin.

Genealogical material should be vetted and we are "encouraged to ask for proof" and allowed to decline if none is found. Do not send verbal abuse, coercive or pressurized notes, please. That isn't genealogy.

I'm not a professional genealogist and never pretended to be. I do my best. If we still are not in agreement, please follow FAQ procedure. You have to have sent actual proof (not merely a claim of or allusion to it) and allow a manager 30 days to review it. Please remember there are other edits too.

Proof is not specifically defined so I have chosen the Genealogical Proof Standard since that is what is used by professional and respected genealogists. That is the 'standard' measure of proof. I can't see why anyone would have an issue with that. It's not perfect, it's more art than science at times; and there will be times I just do not "get it."

I ask that people not become abusive but rather to be patient. If I ask for a few days to think about it, please, do not respond with several more notes of a negative or personal nature or reiterating things already said. Sometimes focusing on something else or other edits for a few days clears my perspective so I can look at the sometimes very complex or elusive proofs with a sharper focus.

If I find proof then typically I accept things very quickly. Otherwise I explain any problems or questions very quickly. Either way I am trying to prove your edits. But if we are honest many come in from leaf hints or as seen on trees without any citations on them.

A census is often not conclusive proof on its own. But I do my best to find any scrap of a clue to bolster it and connect it to what is known about the decedent from cemetery records or verified obituaries, etc.

Please be reasonable about the amount of edits sent at one go; we are all volunteers here. I look up every person involved in a family link suggestion. Lineage or marriage edits should be proven from each direction/person.

I have sent literally thousands (lost count long ago) of citations, typed obits, typed articles, pasted links or data, via "SAC." I follow the same guidelines too. I do not ask anything of anyone else that I have not done for others (without having to be asked first), many times. This system works.

Thank you for your understanding.

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