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LATEST NEWS (7/2024)

According to researchers Marie Rasnick Fetzer, Sharon Bogue Lemkuil and Brett Compton, MARY'S BIRTH YEAR IS IN QUESTION.

Although 1722 is etched on the stone (presumably by son, George, who inherited the Glade Hollow farm) and as evidenced by one particular close up photo of the stone (as provided by brndalrsn in 2007 and is pictured above), when EJ Sutherland later wrote about what was then known about the life of Mary and John and their children and presented it in an address to gathered kin which was published in a booklet, Fetzer, Lemkuil and Compton say that Sutherland quoted Mary's year of birth as being 1728, not 1722 as is etched on her headstone. (It would have been nice if he had taken a photo of it).

In 1948 when Counts kin gathered to commemorate the Counts former homeland and resting places, Mary's birth year was also etched as 1722 on the gigantic memorial stone.

In 2024, the stone's etching is currently very faded but when Mr. Sutherland viewed it in 1931 (93 years earlier than as we view it now) it was much more visible.

WHAT HAPPENED IN HIS RESEARCH TO UNCOVER THIS DIFFERENCE OF 1722 ETCHED ON THE HEADSTONE AND 1728 IN HIS BOOKLET, AND WHY DID SUTHERLAND FAIL TO ADDRESS THIS DISCREPANCY IN HIS ADDRESS AND BOOKLET?? AND WHY WAS 1722 ALSO ETCHED ON THE COMMEMORATIVE STONE PLACED IN 1948?

Ms. Fetzer and Lemkuil ruminated over the six year difference when calculating Mary's "fertile childbearing years" and decided that they agreed with Sutherland's 1728 assessment, not the inscription date of 1722. Mr. Compton believes John & Mary's son, George, made only a guess at her birth year.

Yet more questions regarding the life of John & Mary Counts.

FACTS TO PONDER:

Our John & Mary Counts:

1. Did NOT have children that were born or who died in the Carolina's

2. Our John & Mary have NOT yet been documented to have lived anywhere

other than -

(A) Hawksbill Creek in Frederick County( became Shenandoah, became Page Co. VA in 1765

(B) in Glade Hollow, Russell County, VA beginning in 1789

(C) Died in 1803 (JC Sr) and 1814 (Mary)

3. Our John Counts is NOT DNA compatible with the line of Nicolas X Counts.

4. Their origins prior to about 1749 (thanks to Counts kin and researcher, Brett Compton, locating legal paperwork dated 1749) are TOTALLY UNKNOWN.

(A) Their dates and places of birth are UNKNOWN.

(B) Their parents and siblings are UNKNOWN.

(C) Even the birth dates and places of birth for most of their children are UNKNOWN.

This is not an oversight or a failure to research. It simply means that the quest to fill in the blanks with undocumented information comes from a zeal to know without proof and not taking into account the various unrelated John Counts' living in the Shenandoah Valley during the mid 1700's.

Indepth research by a team of dedicated Counts descendant researchers has been done is still being done (1/2023) for the last few years and is led by the same researcher who found the origins of John Counts son-in/law, Jacob Rasnake, Marie Rasnick Fetzer. Additionally, Sharon Bogue Lemkuil, Brett Compton and Chad Counts are contributing their research findings.

in an effort to clarify the various Counts lines that are not related to this particular John Counts and to ferret out our own John Counts, documents are still being located and scoured. University of VA library holdings are being examined. Lastly, even an overseas researcher was utilized. It will prove to be the most exhaustive attempt since E.J. Sutherland first looked for the origins of John & Mary Counts.

ALL NEW DOCUMENTED FINDINGS will be documented on the website: kayser-counts.org

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5. LETS DISCUSS THE NAME OF SUMMERS:

After researching thoroughly, historian and genealogist, E.J. Sutherland did NOT locate the maiden name for Mary Magdeline Counts.

6. Several places on the internet including Ancestry are saying our Marys maiden name was SUMMERS without identifying any proof or documentation.

7. The undocumented name of "SUMMERS" as Mary's maiden name was recently discovered in 2020 by myself as having being included in the

second volume of Sutherland's book, Some Descendants of John Counts

of Glade Hollow. With absolutely no fanfare that her maiden name had purportedly finally been discovered, the name of Summers was casually included in the book by a Counts kin.

8. When that family member was contacted by myself she revealed that

someone else had supplied that name and she had simply provided it for

the book, apparently not realizing the monumental significance in filling in this detail.

9. When that other someone was then specifically contacted, she admitted

that she had been researching a "DIFFERENT Mary" and someone else had taken her notes and put them "somewhere" on the internet.

10. This undocumented information for a "DIFFERENT Mary" has been oft

repeated but NEVER PROVEN.

By Phyllis Counts, 6x great granddaughter of John & Mary Counts, 2/7/2021.∼E. J. Sutherland read the original old gravestone as "JUNE 25TH 1814 MARY COUNTS WAS BORN 1722"

Mary Magdalene, whose surname has not been proven and is unknown at this time but was often seen as "Summers" in the past, is the wife of John Counts, Sr. who lived in what is now Page County, VA along the Hawksbill Creek near it's mouth and who moved to Glade Hollow in Russell Co., VA where they both died and are buried.

The children of John Counts, Sr. and Mary Magdalene his wife are:

Eve COUNTS Maddox (wife of Matthew Maddox) Eve was named "Oldest daughter"

Philip COUNTS, known as KOUNTZ, (husband of Anna KAYSER, known as KISER, daughter of Carl Sebastian KAYSER AKA: Charles Kayser)

Note: This Philip COUNTS or KOUNTZ (1764-1843) is a different man than the Philip COONTZ (1764-1857) of Barbour Co., VA (WV) who married 1) Mary Heflebower and 2) Barbary Barnhouse

Mary "Mollie" COUNTS Rarsnake or Rasnake (wife of Jacob Rasnake)

John COUNTS, Jr. (husband of Margaret "Peggy" Kelly)

Elizabeth "Lissy" COUNTS Willard (wife of Henry Willard)

Christina COUNTS Lang (wife of Elijah Lang)

Catherine COUNTS Peters, Gray (wife of Michael Peters and John Gray)

George COUNTS (husband of Eve Haynes)

There is a Mary Magdalene Summer (1782-1849) that married a John Counts (1777-1838). This may be where people are getting the Summer/Counts connection. They were from South Carolina and are definitely from a different generation.